EuroCALL 2007 Virtual Strand

Can mobile devices support collaborative practice in speaking and listening? Agnes Kukulska-Hulme & Lesley Shield Lesley: Agnes, can we have a quick prep in SKype? Agnes_KH: sure Vance_XP: coming across fine Penny: briliant! Lesley: Hi Moira MoiraH: Hi all Vance_XP: I'm in the United Arab Emirates Lesley: We're almost ready to start. MoiraH: Great - looking forward to this :-) Lesley: Just waiting for Peppi to come in to moderate Lesley: Peppi will moderate Vance_XP: ah, you made it MoiraH: :-) Lesley: Hmm, the server just went down, but it seems to be back [Guest-1 has entered the meeting - 09/07/07 07:18:36 AM] Vance_XP: I think that means your connection is weak Vance_XP: I get that occasionally Lesley: Peppi says she'll be with us in a minute Vance_XP: click on leave chat, then cancel that, and it comes back [Guest-1 has entered the meeting - 09/07/07 07:19:09 AM] Lesley: OK. Lesley: Hello Graham Penny: hello! Peppi2: Hello! Graham: I'm online, currently blogging Gary Motteram's session on the LANCELOT project. Lesley: Hello Peppi Lesley: We're about to present here, Graham - are you going to multitask? Graham: I'll try! Vance_XP: Graham, be sure and tag your blog post Lesley: I'm impressed! Penny: hahaha!!! love the reminder Vance_XP: either eurocall or eurocall2007 Vance_XP: or both (more is better) Graham: Heike Philp is presenting to us from Germany - live video. Penny: And she was talking in here just before she began as well Peppi2: Hello! I'd like to present our two presenters Lesley and Agnes! The floor is yours :) Graham: Heike gets everywhere - virtually. Lesley: Hi all - we're now presenting. Vance_XP: Hi, oh goodie, a multitasking presentation Lesley: So, Agnes, do you want to lead for the beginning bit? Agnes_KH: Hi Peppi, nice to meet you all, are you enthusiastic about mobile devices? MoiraH: yes Lesley: Is Peppi enthusiastic about mobile devices??? I should say so ;-) Agnes_KH: Has mobile learning been discussed much at the conference? Graham: Couldn't live without my mobile phone! Peppi2: Hi Agnes! Sure I am, I come from the Nokia land :) Vance_XP: What aspect are you most enthusiastic about? Peppi2: Very little in fact Peppi2: I am trying to open Agnes and Lesley's paper here, I hope I will not

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Can mobile devices support collaborative practice in speaking and listening? Agnes Kukulska-Hulme & Lesley Shield crash the system.... http://vsportal2007.googlepages.com/co Peppi2: Sorry, again http://vsportal2007.googlepages.com/collaborativepractice Agnes_KH: Are your students learning with mobile devices already? MoiraH: got it Graham: OK, got it! Lesley: Any sort of mobile device, not just phones? Peppi2: I know of some projects where Nokia communicators have been used as portable learning devices in elementary school Peppi2: Just as one example Lesley: Is that published, Peppi? Lesley: And is it for language learning? Graham: My satnav system is portable and includes voices in over 30 languages. Does that count? Peppi2: I think it is, but in Finnish, I am afraid Lesley: It would depend what you did with it, Graham. Peppi2: It is for all the subjects, incl language Penny: students use phones and mp3 players... whatever kids have... a lot in my classes Agnes_KH: The satnav example is really interesting - is this informal language learning? Graham: 've learned a lot of French from my satnav device. MoiraH: I use the students' cell phones in class and lend mine to them Lesley: For what purpose, Moira? Lesley: And Penny Agnes_KH: How useful is the French you've learnt in this way, Graham? MoiraH: well, so far to replave having to move learners and equipment around and to use their own tools Penny: one eg: i brought back a heap of sim cards from indonesia. students put them in their phones... Penny: ...they can then still use all of the functions of their phone, but cant make calls/SMS etc (because there's no roaming) Penny: it also puts their phone's interface into indonesian MoiraH: so we record, film, exchange files Vance_XP: I'm not sure what a satnay device is Penny: same here, moira :) Vance_XP: satnav Vance_XP: the mobile device that has revolutionized the way I acquire knowledge is my iRiver Agnes_KH: how much do people learn from FL interfaces, in your experience, i.e. unintended learning Graham: Satnav is a visual/talking GPS-based navigation device. Mine is the TomTom Go 910 model. Lesley: Can you explain a little more about why students do this, Moria and Penny? Agnes_KH: How do you use iRiver, Vance? Lesley: What's iRiver, Vance? MoiraH: now I have just been reading about the latest ipod and Nokia700 (I think) MoiraH: any opinions on then? Penny: previously, i'd have to book the 2 video cameras from the library, well in advance... now i have 15-20 video cameras in classes Lesley: But what do they do with the videos, Penny? Vance_XP: iRiver is like iPod MoiraH: right Penny - that's exactly the way I see and use them Graham: I know iRiver. Joe Dale (who has a great blog site) uses his iRiver for recording interviews for podcasts. Page 2 of 6 EuroCALL 2007 Virtual Strand

Can mobile devices support collaborative practice in speaking and listening? Agnes Kukulska-Hulme & Lesley Shield MoiraH: I give my own to whoever wants to use it too and those who don't know the features teach the others Penny: they review their performance, and record again until they're happy with the "final version" of a performance task... Penny: ....use for digital portfolios. unfortunately we can't vodcast it because of no parental clearance Penny: but we do podcasting with phones Peppi2: I found something about the nokia c research I was referring to Peppi2: Here is a link http://www.vink.helsinki.fi/files/ronka_livesite.html Vance_XP: tom tom go 910 is a gps navigation system? MoiraH: in language learning, this is great for immediate peer evaluation too Peppi2: Sorry that was me and my link.... Penny: definitely. that's where we get the most value Peppi2: 10 years old as you can see.... :) Penny: and for showing off at recess! Penny: "look what i did during indonesian..." Vance_XP: (i see tom tom has an iPod connect cable MoiraH: :-) Penny: some have also turned their videos into ringtones so when they call each other, those videos appear MoiraH: og wonderful! Lesley: Is that something they do with videos in their first language, too? In other words, drawing on something Peppi was talking about Lesley: is it a real life task, too? Penny: hmm... i dont think a lot of them had done it before - they hadn't thought to Graham: There is a firm exhibiting here, showing how they plan to use the Sony Portable Playstation for educational purposes. MoiraH: yes, if you mean using the cell phones to record and film anything and everything MoiraH: my kids and all their friends certainly do Penny: im very excited about the wifi capability of the iPhone - and the pricepoint. it means by 2009 it'll be student-priced! Lesley: Yes, that's exactly what I mean. Lesley: So, you're developing on what they already do and moving it into the second/foreign language using mobile devices? MoiraH: so 'doing' it in class is like opening the walls MoiraH: of the classroom Penny: and vice versa... moving 2L/FL learning outside of the classroom Agnes_KH: do you have specific ideas for using the wifi on iPhones? MoiraH: yes Penny: hahaha, moira, we're on the same wavelength MoiraH: maybe we can link our learners up Penny? Penny: not yet! but we have wifi access in my classroom. but we only have a "pod" of 6 computers, 4 of which work, and no lap Penny: laptops Lesley: What about issues of cost, Penny? Penny: that's why i mean by 2009 they'll be affordable for students Penny: the pricepoint for the iPhone and iPod Touch at the moment isn't too bad for professionals MoiraH: not all my f2f learners have cell phones with wifi so we use those phones which do and then put things on a blog or wiki Penny: 2yrs ago the $50 prepaid phone was $500 Graham: What about the negative reports on wifi emanating from some countries, e.g. Austria, where it is banned in schools in some areas MoiraH: depending upon the purpose Page 3 of 6 EuroCALL 2007 Virtual Strand

Can mobile devices support collaborative practice in speaking and listening? Agnes Kukulska-Hulme & Lesley Shield Lesley: What we're really interested in finding out is what's being done.. Lesley: ... that isn't being published, so this is fascinating for us. Penny: well, I work with the tools my learners have access to, and our edu system hasn't read those reports (yet) :) Agnes_KH: Was there anything in our paper that surprised you - the kinds of projects that are reported? Penny: well, it is being published... if you count blogs as "publications" Lesley: YOu'll have noticed that we've mentioned several times in the paper, about *published* research Lesley: No Penny, we mean academic publications Peppi2: http://vsportal2007.googlepages.com/collaborativepractice Lesley: On the whole Penny: its because teachers are too busy *g* Lesley: We know there's a lot out there in blogs, and we know that a lot of people are doing things, but they're not really being ... Lesley: reported widely Lesley: and if they don't tag their blogs - as Vance says - then it's hard to find the entries Penny: for sure Lesley: Vance, do you think tagging would help those of us looking for this sort of publication? Vance_XP: of course Agnes_KH: M-learning is still in its early days - do you think e-learning was the same in its early days? Penny: i can't talk... iv actually got data, should be trying to get published, and yet... Lesley: You know, don't you, about the special edition of ReCALL on mobile learning? Penny: no? Vance_XP: I find myself resorting mostly to the blogosphere for academic information Penny: oh wait Penny: yes! Graham: How do you define e-learning? The UK government defines it simply as using a computer - and not necessarily online. Penny: vance: i'm finding that too MoiraH: they're calling for proposals, correct? Agnes_KH: What are your starting points in the blogosphere Vance? Vance_XP: well, depends Agnes_KH: Indeed e-learning is a very elastic term! Vance_XP: mostly it's word of mouth (FOAF) this blog post commented on by this blogger was interesting MoiraH: what exactly do you mean by 'starting points' Agnes? Vance_XP: or mentioned in Stephen Downes Vance_XP: but for searching, technorati, del.icio.us, google blog search Agnes_KH: I mean, where you start a search, e.g. going to Google first Graham: Google works most of the time for me - and for others. A long-lost cousin found me via a Google search that threw up my name in MoiraH: ah, ok Graham: a blog. [Guest-2 has entered the meeting - 09/07/07 07:47:24 AM] Peppi2: Will the blog references be treated as "proper" references? Penny: in a well-read blog, i'm wondering if we can argue that commenting is a form of peer review Vance_XP: it's almost the best form of peer review MoiraH: my niece in england was doing a family tree for her school and she found my picture by googling images Page 4 of 6 EuroCALL 2007 Virtual Strand

Can mobile devices support collaborative practice in speaking and listening? Agnes Kukulska-Hulme & Lesley Shield Penny: that's what im thinking Peppi2: True, Penny. But the academic criteria are getting really tight in that respect Vance_XP: your post will be reviewed by peers almost as soon as you press enter Lesley: I wonder if we're moving away from mlearning a bit here... Vance_XP: yes we can talk about this tomorrow Lesley: So, going back to mlearning ... ;-) Penny: it's all related *s* Lesley: as Agnes asked, was there anything that surprised you in our paper? Anything you found interesting/worth discussing/a waste of Lesley: ... time... Vance_XP: it is, because mLearning is closely tied to the blogosphere Vance_XP: in so far as podcasts are simply audio blogs MoiraH: if you have the right m-device to read it on ;-) Penny: yes, and i admit, my students have used their mobiles mainly to record audio/video for the purpose of blogging/podcasting it Penny: they could use any device, but it's just what they happen to have MoiraH: but now with the mobi.com etc Agnes_KH: Most teachers probably don't see m-learning as being tied in to the blogosphere Penny: same as i'm not fussed if they write in blue pen or black pen Vance_XP: of course with mobile devices you get mp3 capability plus connection with internet Penny: most teachers probably aren't as geeky *g* Vance_XP: how will these develop as regards education? Agnes_KH: Do they need to become more geeky then? Vance_XP: in mobile devices? What potentials are there? Penny: no, they'll retire and there'll be a newskool even newer than us Lesley: or should we, as Peppi was saying yesterday, be looking at what students really do with these devices? Lesley: why they use them Graham: Must leave for a few minutes, as the discussion in my other session is windiing up now. [Graham has left the meeting] Lesley: ok, thanks Graham Penny: they really spend a lot of time sms'ing... so i teach them to sms in the TL... :) Lesley: Hi Rita MoiraH: i rita :-) RitaZ: hi, Leslie and all :-) Vance_XP: hi rita Peppi2: Hi! MoiraH: sorry but my keyboard is not happy with certain capitols today :-( Penny: we recently had 10 students from surabaya stay with us (homestays) and mobile phones really brought everyone together... RitaZ: can see ;-) Lesley: That's interesting, Penny. Penny: ....they could all relate to phones and they literally got to know each other by talking about them and sharing numbers Agnes_KH: Penny, how do you yourself know how to SMS in the TL - is it through TL friends you have? MoiraH: yes, I often start off courses by just asking everybody to put eir mobile on the table Penny: no, i studied in indonesia as part of my degree for a year, and mobile phones are HUGELY popular there (2001) Peppi2: Sorry to barge in on the interesting discussion, 5 minutes left :) Page 5 of 6 EuroCALL 2007 Virtual Strand

Can mobile devices support collaborative practice in speaking and listening? Agnes Kukulska-Hulme & Lesley Shield MoiraH: it's a great icebreaker Penny: absolutely Penny: and it can be an icebreaker in the TL for higher level learners Vance_XP: put their mobile on the table? What then? RitaZ: we might be using sms for our stds yo connect with others, echanging numbers with teachers, as we do on skype

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Sep 7, 2007 - Penny: im very excited about the wifi capability of the iPhone - and the ... Vance_XP: it's almost the best form of peer review ... with internet.

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